Timing in the 20 card Celtic Cover



  • All I'm asking about is timing. I'm using the Celtic Dragon Tarot. I dealt the standard Celtic Cross, 1-10 and then covered each card with a second, going in reverse order. The card(s) to the right of the Querent are the 9 of Swords covered by the inverted 10 of Swords. The tenth and eleventh cards - the final outcome cards- are the 10 of Cups covered by the 4 of Pentacles. So I'm asking about the timing regarding two specific positions; four cards. I think I've interpreted the nature of the events with fair accuracy (although it boggles my mind to do so), but I would like to know, roughly WHEN they are going to occur. My thinking thus far has been to break down, at least the swords as 10 + 9 = 19 => 1 + 9 = 10: So probably 10 days. Sound good? Now there's the 10 of Cups covered by the 4 of Pentacles. That's 14 or 5, correct? 5 what, weeks or months? Am I doing this right at least as far as the Swords go? I was also thinking that they might also refer to 10:00, but nothing's happened so far. Anyway, exactly how far off base am I? How the heck does timing work, and for which cards in which positions? It might be important to mention that I deal differently. I go querent, cover, up, down, right, left, (Father, Son, Holy Spirit) bottom to top, 7, 8, 9, 10. Make sense?

    Any help you can offer would be greatly appreciated. I created my account specifically so I could ask this question. God bless.

    Stradella



  • I used to do this spread like the one above. boy it's complicated, and can take forever to understand it. why such a complex spread? here is how I can help you with timing then you can take that and apply it if it makes sense for you.

    pentacles = months to 12 months

    aces = days to 30 days

    wands = months not days or weeks

    swords = 12 months to several years

    swords is all about thinking and looking for solutions. swords can represent obsession and depression. it's all about rational thinking.

    wands is about action and the opposite of swords. a can do attitude and negative or positive outlook can make a difference with manifesting things. it usually implies to the work place or the home. where y ou apply most of your energy. work or home or somewhere else? home is where the heart is.

    for example, if you pull the 4 of wands reversed would suggest either the place you reside in is not the right place for you, and may imply it would be time to move.

    pentacles = is about your material affairs such as money, home, and investments. can imply to work as well.

    4 of pentacles is someone who is very uptight and reserve and does not share his/her wealth or share his/her heart.

    Aces = is about matters of the heart. it's not always about love with another person, it can imply to love for a project. for example, you are wishing for a perfect job with a company and the nine of heart would suggest you could and are perfect for this job.

    10 of swords reversed with the 9 of swords covering is an indication of drama and depression. repeat of drama over and over is causing severe mental issues and it's time to stop the drama or it will get worse.

    10 of cups covered by the 4 of pentacles would suggest one or the other.. you have a desire to join a particular group of folks. could be a place like a club, and you are interested in joining this group. it also represents family, or a strong desire to create a family. the 4 of pentacles is suggesting extreme caution is required. could be someone is creating blocks, paperwork, red tape, lots of protocol to break down in order to get what you want or desire.

    hope that helps some.. Sunny



  • The other thing I forgot to add was the count of suits. for example, you pulled 20 cards, and most of your cards are pentacles and swords with little cups, and no wands. Major Arcana is about the overall Theme, the headline. what is the overall theme of your reading or concern. if it's all pentacles or 80% pentacles, then what you are working towards, is manifesting, it's about stability, foundation, and creating long term plans materialistically. y our primary concern would be about finances, stability and setting down roots.

    Cups or very little cups in your spread would indicate it's very important, and that it would create joy and happiness, but it's not an emotional investment, ie; having a baby, falling in love, getting married, and creative projects.



  • nine and ten of Swords just sounds like a hell of a day. All I want to know is which day it'll be. If I know when, maybe I can figure out what and then maybe it won't be so bad.



  • Does my round about attempt at numerology make sense? Should I be extra careful this Saturday, for instance? The 10th? 10 + 9 = 19, 9 + 1 = 10?



  • I am having trouble understanding what you are wanting. as I explained above on timing, did you read it?

    if you are asking about an outcome on when, what was the outcome cards?



  • Your outcome cards were:

    10 of cups covered by the 4 of pentacles would suggest one or the other.. you have a desire to join a particular group of folks. could be a place like a club, and you are interested in joining this group. it also represents family, or a strong desire to create a family. the 4 of pentacles is suggesting extreme caution is required. could be someone is creating blocks, paperwork, red tape, lots of protocol to break down in order to get what you want or desire.

    I wrote that above already. I honestly can't say if it will be this saturday... look at the entire spread.. do you have a lot of reverses? lots of swords? it does seem from the 10 and 9 of swords is that you are letting this situation/issue become and has been an obsession.

    you need to step back a bit, and not obsess so much on this. clarity is needed right now.

    Sunny



  • I meant no disrespect, Ms Sunny. I just don't think we're on the same page. I'm not obsessing as much as you think, but I understand why you might think so. This is just something I want to get figured out. The 10 of Cups and 4 of Pents is aggravatingly obvious as per the nature of the event. I don't believe this event will ever transpire, but for the sake of things...

    First off, regarding what you posted before, as far as time indicators I see Pents, Aces, Wands, and Swords. What measurement of time do Cups indicate? Also, my original thinking was that A-10 indicated 'amount of-' and the suits indicated the unit of time: Swords -Days (or maybe hours), Wands -Days to Weeks, Cups -Weeks to Months, and Pentacles -months to years. In other words, the 3 of Cups might mean 3 weeks or 3 months. I'm getting this out of "The Complete Idiot's Guide to Tarot." I got both the spread and the aforementioned interpretations from the same book and nowhere is there mention of how to apply the interpretations to the spread! VERRY annoying... Can you comment? I'd like to reiterate that I'm not trying to be obstinate or offensive. I'm grateful for all the help I can get, even if we start out not understanding one another;-)

    I was also wondering if time interpretation might be subjective. I understand your thinking the 4opents and 10ocups maybe being an 'either or' kinda' thing, but if that were so why are they BOTH there? As far as the lovely Swords conjunction, I can't for the life of me guess the nature of the event, nor do I really care. I would, however like to know WHEN it is going to transpire. As per your first post, am I to understand that the event won't take place for 9 or 10 YEARS, what with your interpretation of Swords being that they refer to 12 months or a number of years? Am I figuring that right? Also, if they refer to me being obsessive than wouldn't they be in a different place, for instance the Querent's position, or maybe the Number 2 position? Besides, the whole reason I'm BEING 'obsessive' is because they showed up. The 10 AND the 9 just sound like a really bad day, and when to the right of the Querent, it sounds like it's coming up soon. I don't really believe what I think the 10 of Cups pertains to is at all likely to occur, but it could refer to something totally different and make total sense with the 4 of Pentacles and I'd just not understand until after it had come to pass. It sounds like a good day regardless so I'm not worried, but since I'm here I'd like to see if I can figure out the 'when' of it if for no other reason than for the sake of practice. Of course, if it is what I THINK it is and it never happens like I think it won't, it's just a moot point, huh? Oh well.

    I thought about the balance of suits in the spread and it was pretty evenly balanced between the four of them and the Majors. (Don't ask me to try to remember which Majors they were, they didn't pose any kind of major quandary).

    Basically, if I use your translations, I understand that Swords should refer to years, but would that be 9 years or 10 years? Whatever the other two relate to the 10 of Cups and the 4 of Pentacles, will it happen in 10 months, or 4 months, or what? That's it! That's my big question! Disregarding that we may not agree on which suit indicates weeks, days, months, or years, ( I may yet adopt your method, by the way) I just want to know how to interpret HOW MANY - REGARDLESS OF WHAT. Which numbers am I looking at? The numbers on the first card? The card covering it? Some combination of the two? As far as the UNIT of time, worst case scenario I'll just make a checklist: Did anything bad happen at 10:00? No. On the 10th of July? No. 10 Days later? No... etc.10 years Later?.. Will I even remember that long? I just want to know WHICH NUMBERS SHOULD I LOOK AT? HOW MANY OF WHATEVER (WEEKS, DAYS, DECADES) I'M DEALING WITH.

    I'd also like to mention that the bit about Wands=Action, Swords=Thought, Cups=Emotions, and Pents=Worldly Possessions clicked right away with me. That's straight out of all my books and the way I've been thinking ;-).

    Thanks so much for all the help;-) Bod Bless .



  • Hi there,

    I did not feel you were disrespecting me, and I was only trying to understand your question with the spread/timing. Now, I do understand. you gave yourself a reading, but you had no real question(s) but it was a general reading and probably you were just curious.

    I take it, tarot is new for you? or figuring out timing.. after 30 years of playing with tarot and other oracles, I have learned through trail and error. you will have to learn to do the same.

    what I mean is, when you do a reading, you mark the date and then you wait until it does materialized, and then you can go back, and reread the spread and be able to measure timing. by keeping a good record in your journal, this will be a good reference for future reads. this is how you learn, and how you learn, you will find what is comfortable for you, and is done over time.. not one day.

    since I am not able to look at the entire spread, but only can work with the four cards you have subconsciously very focused on, so lets work with those 4 cards.

    ok... I am wildly intuitive, and go with the flow when I do reads, and a lot depends on what YOU say in your conversation with me, I have picked up several things about you. more on that bit later though and stay tuned..

    as per above, I explained briefly what the 10 of cups meant (to me). cups represents emotions/feelings of the heart. the 4 of pent being the covered card would suggest to me that is dominant over the 10 of cups. what would that say in regards to timing?

    most likely the timing is roughly 4 months. I am feeling around early fall time. and it could represent a family gathering or a reunion with old friends or something along those lines will be coming up in the near future. four of pentacles do show restraint, and usually implies with finances. it could also represent some type of inheritance coming through a family member whether or not this person is deceased is not clear...are you in need of borrowing money or will you be loaning money.

    the 9 and 10 of swords were the first two cards?? that would suggest current state of mind or situation. are you feeling rather pessimistic or a sense of doom in your current situation? could be just your state of mind and how you feel about your work place for example. your work maybe putting you under enormous pressure, where you feel you want to explode, but that will soon shift to better or calmer times coming up.

    it really depends on the other cards, the overall spread is what I look for various suits, how many there are, in other words what is dominant in the entire spread.

    over time you will change to a different spread, or use a simpler formula. to be honest, the formula you described is fitting for a mathematician. lol pretty much went over my head. lol

    being intuitive requires you to let go of logic and reason. nothing wrong with your formula, I am only saying (lol)

    hope that helps some, and nice meeting you.. Sunny



  • Thanks once again Sunny. The journal idea is definitely the big hole in the plan for me. It's the one thing I've not been doing. It's just a matter of being lazy. I just bought myself what's going to be my Tarot journal. I am, in fact, exceptionally pessimistic about my question, but the Swords were neither in the Querent's position, the surrounding energy position, nor the hopes and fears position. They were in what would be the 6th position in a standard Celtic Cross spread. That indicated to me an quickly upcoming event. I guess I've lost trust in my intuition to a certain degree. It seems it was my intuition that led me into this mess I find myself in. I was very aggravated when I saw the 10 of Cups, actually.

    The way my book told me to do it was to look at the number on the card and the suit. For in stance the ace of Swords should indicate one day. the 9 of Pentacles might be either 9 months or 9 years. As I said before, they didn't mention how that should apply to the Celtic Cover (same book). In another part of the book they talk about finding the Key Numbers of major arcana by adding the numbers of the double digit cards. for instance with the Devil, # 15, you would look at the number 5 (conflict), the number 10 (getting over bad things, I guess, in this case), and also the number 6 ( 1 + 5, committing oneself to good things, I guess). That last bit was where I was getting my idea. What else was I supposed to do with two different cards in each position?

    So anyway, does it just come down to subjectivity? Either intuition, or look at the cover card, or add'm up and reduce'm or something like that? Practice and see which one works? WITH THE JOURNAL? K' I'll definitely try that one.

    Nice meeting you too.

    Stradella


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