Help with interpretation
Hi and thank you in advance for all the replies anyone posts.
A few days ago I did a reading for someone (a good friend) in severe distress who comitted a fraud some time ago and it was discovered recently. He managed to earn about one week to see what will happen and says that either he is lucky and solves it or sees a way to solve it soon or will take his own life. I know him and know that he will do so. If for no other reason because of his pride and extra-large ego which could not take the blow of such thing becoming known. I read tarot for over 15 years and it is the first time that I'm faced with something so serious like this reason why I ask for others' views. This is why I registered here, asking for the views of other people perhaps more experient than I am and which may had been faced with something like this in the past.
The exact question was what was going to happen within the next week regarding this subject. I drew a celtic cross. There were several major arcana in the reading showing its utmost importance and, among other cards which described the situation very accurately, for the future portion of the reading we got "The World" for the near future, "The Judgement" for the future influence and "Death" as the outcome. While the two first cards could indicate something positive and the solution for his problems, the "Death" card as the outcome in conjunction with the other two, mainly with "The Judgement", led me to believe that there is in fact the very serious risk of him really taking his like. I shut up about that although mentioned change, dramatic change, which could be for the better and even that he could get lucky or somehow manage to earn more time. I became very distraught by the whole situation and about the reading itself.
My question to the forum is precisely if you would also see these three cards for the future as indication of an impending suicide.
Thank you all.
I'll do a reading on this as I'm unclear on the positions you drew in. Can prob have up by tomorrow am. Just on what I got that you disclosed--how he perceives the situation or what he feels the outcome is his challenge, fearing the outcome--this is as much of his choice about how things end up, death can be the ending not so much as physical but as the end of the circumstance. I would have to see all cards about the advice for him to help him. I'll do a reading.
Hi Daliolite, thank you very much for your reply and assistance. I'll be looking very much forward to receiving your reading on this subject.
RdSM, I didn't draw any pentacle cards regarding this situation which surprised me. Pentacles involving money. I'm getting more idea/putting the idea into motion. Perhaps he was the brains, so to speak, of this fraud. Was he left in charge of something. This is an emotional time for him. Have you known him for awhile. I'm getting childhood in challenges/maybe he was naieve in thinking he would get away w/something. I'm also getting groups or group of people. People have also turned their backs on him--this is affecting him tremendously. He has put himself in this situation. I'm seeing you as the queen of cups. You'll be able to help him emotionally. Maybe one of the only people left who is offering support. I'm also getting a woman in the situation which sprang from all of this. Is the blame being put solely on him. He may feel this way. This situation will be softened. I drew the high priestess in advice. He may have someone like a female attorney help him. I don't know who the queen of rods is in this scenario. Showing his battle will be softened--high priestess/strength. He needs to distance himself from all the drama. Needs on some level to accept his responsibility for this. Drew a couple #8 cards. I see the situation working itself through.
over--queen of cups
below--king of cups
situation--queen of rods
past--5 of rods
challenges--6 of cups
future--7 of rods
blocks--3 of cups
friends--8 of cups
outcome--8 of swords
Daliolite, thank you very much for this reading and insight!
Truth his that I am worried about him. He's been spending the week doing only what he loves most in this world, beach and sea, nothing else. I don't know if I'm the queen of cups for I'm a man.
Yes, he was the brains and sole executor of the fraud which involved more or less something which he was left in charge, yeah. It is related with his family money and the queen of rods is the victim of the fraud. Indeed, he thought he would get away with it somehow. He thought he'd be able to pay it with luck alone before anyone could notice. We know each other for a long time, since childhood, and no doubt I am the only one offering support right now. Nobody else knows about the situation but me and, of course, those who found out although he didn't volunteer any details to those who uncovered him. Besides, as a rule, I don't tend to be judgemental. It was him who turned his back on everybody else and this is a feature of his character since ever, although he is most able to disguise his feelings in such a way that nobody can even have a hint of his real state of mind. When in trouble he always goes away from almost everybody but me and even me sometimes.... It wasn't the time for a lecture, anyway. To me he offered several more details and I'm confident he told me the whole story. He needed to, anyway, for he was on the verge of a breakdown. He reached the point of telling me about it and that alone is an indication of his despair.
I wish he could distance himself from this right now but it is not an option because it happened at the worst possible time, money-wise, for him. He accepts responsibility for it, no doubt there, but his way of apologising for such thing like he did is offering his own life as payment. He knows what he did, he knows that he can not go back and undo it all and he knows that it will be known by many people who see him as Mr. Perfect, including his parents, cousins, everybody. His ego can't stand such ordeal at all.
Well, I'm ending up venting a little too for I'm worried and know for sure that if he really decides to take his life there is nothing I can do about it, nor even hint on exactly when, where, how, etc, etc. All I know is that he would do it very hush-hush which is an added problem.
Hi again, I'm just getting not to think the worst and help this person, if you can. This is something that they got themselves into. I see the situation as you described it in the cards. He does feel up against a wall. This is an emotional person. Try to help, if you can.
Hi Daliolite, thank you for your message of encouragement. Up against a wall, there isn't a better way to describe the way he feels. We were together today, went to the beach, stayed there all afternoon. He knows lots of people there and for everyone he was his usual self. Noone could say that he was passing thru the worst ever in his life. He is very emotional, no doubt there, but keeps it all inside and is successful at that.. Only thing different today was that he is smoking slightly more than usual. I'm doing all I can but, really, I'm starting to be scared about this. Monday is the deadline that he was able to buy. Days are passing, nothing is happening and also he doesn't want to speak about it.
He is the guy who does these silly, childish things but he is also the guy who enrolled as volunteer in a program for poor people and teaches both adolescents and adults, the adolescents as extra classes so that they get results and do not abandon school, the unemployed adults as a way for them to increase their knowledge and improve their curriculum. He is capable of saying the most arrogant thing in the world to someone he feels deserves to hear it but he is also the guy who puts himself between an abusive police officer and a young boy who was being victim of harassment by the officer. Many people see him as cold hearted and indeed he projects that image but in reality he is the guy who sees an old beggar sick in the street and gets with his eyes all watered. He is the guy who gets in the rough sea when he sees two young kids being taken away on their bodyboards and in the end moves away before their father has the opportunity to say anything.
Almost noone knows (his family doesn't and only a few close friends do) about his volunteer work, his feelings, him saving the two kids, etc, etc, for he does not say a word about it neither he likes that anyone mentions so.
I'll do all I can but I have a feeling that this weekend won't be a good weekend. No, it won't. I'm scared.
Will he get any miracle within the next three days? I truly hope and pray that he does.
Hi Daliolite, just woke up, have to go out and do some errands here and then, later on, to the beach with him again. Let's see what the new day reserves us both.
Would you be able to do a reading for how will this coming weekend be for me? It's not common for me to ask for readings but right now I am terribly worried and somewhat lost on my mind to a point where I can't even read myself. Thank you so much for the support you've been giving me with this. With each hour I become more and more worried.
Yes, prob today
Thank you so much, Daliolite.
Today, another day on the beach, not much talking about the subject although his major concern is his dog... :S
Rdsm, The reading in present is speaking of working things out as a group/working on things. Also, ideas in motion as opposed to talking about. I'm getting this idea of being perfect and it has a lot of implications on how he feels. Things haven't been perfect although this is the role he feels he's had to create. Immaturity is paired with the consequences of the real world. Future deals with learning and choosing. He sees a financial struggle. He can still rebuild his life. I see him doing something outside as income. I see him as an outdoor type, anyway. Maybe he can't live-up to expectations/financial expectations. Judgment is in the past. I don't know if he made a decision in past. I don't know if he's already been involved in the court system. A decision being made in past. You figure-in the present. Because this has and is showing as such an extremely emotional time, have you considered possibly a religious person talking w/him. I'm getting that from the 3 of coins/5 of coins paired--ok. I do feel you're helping and can help. Outcome is page of cups. I take it that you read cards. I see a lot of pride here in this person.
present--knight of rods
above--6 of swords
below--3 of coins
situation--6 of cups
challenges--5 of coins
future--4 of cups
blocks--7 of coins
friends--5 of swords
advice--2 of cups
outcome--page of cups
Rdsm, His message here is to accept help and rebuild. We all make mistakes, even if that's never said to us by those we love.
Daliolite, thank you so much. I'll show him this early tomorrow and focus on the part where you say "He can still rebuild his life". Yes, I read tarot since when I was around 18-19 years old but right now I don't have the energy to do so. This is draining me a lot. We know each other since school, when we were both 6 and always been very close to each other. We are closer than most brothers I know.
You are right on everything you said about him. He is (we both are) an outdoors type, yeah. Would you have any further details on an outdoors income? Also, quite right when you see pride. He is a very proud guy, very, very proud and that is the reason why he had to create a role which amounts almost to a whole fictious life, for his family and where problems started. Many years ago he and his father went apart and don't speak to each other ever since. This happened 15 or 16 years ago. One of the things the man told him was that he wouldn't be anybody in his life because of being gay. And he tried the utmost in order to be somebody. It worked out +- ok for some years but then his legendary bad luck intervened and things started going astray. A little over one year ago he committed this fraud at a very hard moment for him money-wise and that is the decision represented by the judgement, not any problems with the law. He never had anything of the sort. He was between a rock and a hard place and at the time all he could do was trying to make and gain time and that is when all this started. The decision he made was that he would take his life if he was ever discovered before being able to put back what he took. It is not only the issue of being ashamed and feeling guilty which he is and feels. It is also and most of all that when something like this becomes known by everybody in his family all they think of him will burn to the ground, the whole part he created will go away like smoke and, worst, for the first time ever they will have something to point their fingers at him and nobody will miss the opportunity. Something like this will, undoubtly, reach his fathers' ears and will be the greatest satisfaction the man will have in years, to learn that his son did something like this and best of all something as serious as this is. It will be a joyfull moment for the man. In the meantime my friend tried to work things out, of course but, oh oh oh, is legendary bad luck came again and he broke a foot while walking with his dog. We were together and I didn't fall in the same hole by luck. I let him and the dog go in front so they were the ones who went down. It could had been me had I crossed first and right now I wish I had been the one with the injury. The worst of this accident wasn't the foot. It was the effect it had on him, on his self-confidence and the way he felt in general. At a time when he was rebuilding his life this happened and it had a terrible effect on his spirit. One of the effects leads me to something you said, talking with some religious person. With this accident he lost his faith. It had never happened before. At times he used to complain that God didn't like him and things of the sort but this time he really lost his faith which, in a way, he was now slowly recovering. He even went to a sanctuary with his mother a couple weeks ago. Back when of the accident I remember him saying that it wasn't fair that something like that happened to him right at that time when things were starting to go fine again and the fact that it did proves one of two things, that either God does not exist or He exists and hates him. Sometime during the outburst of anger caused by the accident he threw out all religious things he had at his place. Books, images, a rosary, he threw it all in the garbage. This happened in February and only recently was he starting to think about moving forward again. And now the fraud was discovered, another blow, the worst he could get at a terrible time and right after he went to a sanctuary asking for protection and a little bit of luck. All things add up to where he is right now. One thing I must say. His world his falling apart, his life is a wreck, he is suffering, he deeply feels all this and, somehow, he manages to keep his composure and keeps on being is usual self for everybody. By looking at him noone would dream about his current predicaments. He keeps on playing and making jokes, going to the beach, late summer days like any other late summer days.
His XXXXL-sized ego, some conceptions about life, his education, his past, the materialism with which he was raised and which is a rule in his family, mainly for the grand-mother, everything, led to this. The role he created was in large part to be respected by granny for she doesn't respect (quite the opposite) anyone who isn't successful. For instance, he has several justifications for taking his life but one of them concerns what he deeply feels is a man's duty when faced with something like this. He feels, always did and this comes from his education, that when a man behaves as a mouse, then, his only option is paying with his life. Also, he can't stand disappointing his grand-mother so much, let alone becoming despised by her. Another reason concerns the victim of the fraud who is an aunt of his. He feels (and well, I tend to agree with him here) that if he dies then his father, a very very very wealthy man, will step forward and cover the losses something the man won't do under any other circumstance.
So, all this adds up. I love him like a brother, a very dear brother. We've been together thru a lot and I'd do almost anything to get him out of this schizofrenic crazy world of his. Unfortunately I can't (and he wouldn't accept it) cover the amount he embezzled. And I'm scared. Terribly scared. We had dinner together, took him home, wanted to stay there, wanted him to come and stay with me, nothing worked. He just wants things to keep on going as they always did. Doesn't see any reason to change an inch on anything. Him being so calm is what scares me the most.
Daliolite, thank you, thank you, really, for helping me. Writing it here is a way for me to vent a little and somehow recharge my batteries to keep on coping with the situation. It helps, it really helps knowing that someone reads it. Thank you so much, Daliolite.
I'm glad I can help. If you need anything, let me know. Thanks for looking-out for your friend.
Finally, today, we managed to speak about the ordeal. His calmness worries me more than anything else and the way he speaks about all this in such calm and dispassionate way like if we were talking about where to have dinner. It started with talking about how he will miss several things, the good things like we had today. I showed him your reading, Daliolite, with emphasis in the possibility of rebuilding his life to no avail. He doesn't believe he can do so and that only a miracle can save him now. Miracles are short these days. Also he doesn't see anyone who can help him get started again with his life. I can help and he knows about that but I can't cover his losses nor give much more than being there. His pride is a further obstacle. It is interesting that the focus is changing from taking his life outright to trying to find some way to avoid him doing it. He doesn't want to die and says so but also doesn't see any other option. I'm confident that perhaps together we could find a way to make it work, he isn't. He feels defeated.
For now he is safe. He went to have dinner with granny but afterwards we will go out and he will stay at my place tonight. Tomorrow is another day and I just wish I could remember something, some option, some possibility, something.
I have a bad feeling for today... Very bad.
Rdsm, Usually don't do readings on sun but felt a need--on your behalf. Your friend is holding onto this idea of his. There are several cards here with a message, 4 of swords, 4 of coins and temperance. This idea of withdrawing, I believe, is connected w/ the need to get away from drama surrounding him. The real need here is to get to the truth. Money doesn't buy happiness. I do see you helping him in things to come. He will be able to rebuild but won't be handed to him. I see some sort of financial recovery--ace of coins in future position. I do see you as a major player as someone who will help him rebuild. The message for him, again, is to rebuild. He couldn't have better placement in friends position--temperance. I think you help him see both sides. Is there a water sign here. I usually don't ask for astro signs but I have drawn a lot of cards indicating a water sign.
present--king of coins
over--4 of coins
below--page of swords
situation--4 of swords
past--queen of rods
challenges--page of coins
future--ace of coins
blocks--8 of swords
advice--knight of cups
outcome--8 of coins
Rdsm, I think he needs to rebuild from the ground-up, if you can relate. Sometimes our lives don't follow the pre-cepts of how we're raised. Sometimes wealthy families leave relatives in nursing homes w/o visiting. Money doesn't dictate who we are--we do. Tell him this. There is always another chapter. He may be ashamed but can always say sorry, it was a mistake and continue--that doesn't cost anything. You have offered him your time and sympathy, that's priceless as well.
Thank you so much for all your support Daliolite, for all your assistance, for your readings, for helping me endure this. I just arrived home and it was so conforting reading your messages. He is missing right now and I'm really scared although being able to keep a cold head. Mobile is off, I went to his usual places and he isn't anywhere, couldn't find him anywhere. He had lunch with his mother who doesn't know anything about this and went missing ever since. Now I am really worried and scared. Next step, call the authorities... although I know that if he doesn't want to be found he won't be. He is way to clever to be found before wanting to be so.
Yesterday and today morning I thought that we were being able to somehow connect on this field, on trying something. We spoke about something he could do but, of course, everything takes time, a precious commodity he doesn't have. On the outdoors field we spoke about being a lifeguard, something he could do, he could easily do the course and complete the exam but this requires time, something he feels he doesn't have. He knows he can come to my place and stay for as long as he wants for after tomorrow or shortly after he will even be left without a roof. My apartment is small but we can manage. The apartment where he lives is his grand-mother's who after finding out, will renege on him. As a matter of fact, if the worst happens, I can easily picture her saying that he did what he had to do. If he doesn't I can see her denouncing it to the authorities and the 8 of swords in both your readings scares me a little on that particular. It is not the highest possibility but it isn't anything remote as well. We aren't speaking about any minor thing, it is up to the tune of 18000€. :(( I can't cover this money. I can't!
Yes, the need to get away is to run away from all the drama and the worst of it. Also getting away from disappointing his family, his grand-mother, all the mockery, etc, etc, it is way too much for his ego and for him in general. He in running away from the truth. He doesn't see any option, any possibility for him to re-start his life, nothing, nothing at all. His family, except perhaps his mother with whom he doesn't get along perfectly, will turn his back on him and when this reaches his father's hears the man will have a field day.
As a boy and during adolescense he was very materialistic, tremendously so. As the years passed he learnt a lot and quit being so. His materialism these days comes mostly from the need to live up to his family's expectations. Lately all he wants is to be able to live quietly, nothing else. He was doing it when of the broken foot. The worst thing in the world. Nothing worst could had happened and when it did.
Rebuild, Daliolite, rebuild, I SO wish he can interiorize that concept, I SO wish that in the end that option prevails above all the others...
Thank you Daliolite, thank you so much. If I receive any news I'll let you know. You are being so kind... Thank you!!
rdsm, Is there a chance of him running away and creating a new life. I get that with the 6 of swords above in a reading I did for you. Has he mentioned this to you. Based on some of the decisions he's made, this may be a possibility. I didn't mention this before but felt the likelihood.