The heart of a Virgo man

  • Hi forevervirgo - I'm so sorry to hear what is going on with you and your Virgo. It's awful to be left hanging like that. I'm curious about something. You say he was married for 8 months? And in that short 8 months his wife caused him "lots of stress"? This is very odd to me. Any idea what had him so stressed out? How long had he known her before they got married? Any idea what goes on now between he and she that continues to drag this "hurt" of his out? I'm assuming they didn't have a child together in that short time, although one can never assume anything that way these days, lol. So why does he interact with her? One thing I must point out, that as long as he is still feeling hurt over her, no matter what the cause, he has not let go of something. And I'm not even saying it's her, but it could be some sense in himself that he contributed to the collapse of the relationship, or some aspect of himself that he struggles with and doesn't like.

    But from what you've said, It seems to me that he is not ready for a relationship. He may use his experience with his ex as an excuse, however, looking at what transpired with his marriage, I wonder if he was ready for that relationship either? Will he ever really be ready for a relationship?

    I think that if you at least had some final accounting between you two, then you would feel better about moving on. It stinks not knowing the rest of the story and what went through his mind that "flipped his switch". From my point of view, and what little I have to go on, it doesn't seem that this is really about you. It's about him. As for why he can't just be straight with you about anything, you might have noticed in this thread, this part of the Virgo mystery that we have yet to solve here. Why is it so hard to just be open? Do they think that they are hurting you less by simply vanishing? My guess is that they hurt less themselves by not facing the hurt they cause to others, yet hold on to the thought that they are hurting you less and pretend that that makes sense. I say this because I know that my Virgo has this illusion about communication. He doesn't understand that it's worse to be left in the unknown, than it is to simply hear the truth even when it might be disappointing. Even though he is cut to the core if anyone does this to him. Still, he has no empathy. He seems completely unable to put the shoe on the other foot and realize how others feel when he treats them the same way.

    Do you live far away from this man? You said that you were friends before things turned into more. Do you expect that you will see him again eventually? Have you known each other as friends long enough that you would be comfortable with just going to his home and talking to him? I do think that him erasing your messages is him erasing you because, unless there is some crazy explanation for this that I can't even fathom, he is making that conscious decision to delete your messages without reading them. He doesn't want to face what you have to say, and I'm sure he expects for you to just "get the message". He is taking the easy way out - easy for him anyway.

  • Hi,

    thank you jenever for your comments. I did feel hurt when I saw him delete my messages. But I know he is shutting me out. Its like total shut down, i only called him 3 times in a period of three weeks, he surely must have his own personal calls from friends coming through?and each time his phone was off. He showed me so much affection and made it clear that it was just me and him and then vanished.

    He knows me enough to know that all my messages would say is I hope we can be friends again especially as it was him that wanted to go beyond friendship I am willing to forget about that so why not him? If anything it should be me thinking if you led me on pursued me then why vanish? I have not said this to him, because I am trying to understand this from his point of view.

    It feels like he is punishing me.

    He knew his ex wife for a period of a year. before they married, he has been divorced for four years but now i am questioning everything. He works very hard and apparently the marriage fell apart when he became busy with work that she felt neglected. He kept saying things like she seemed so nice at first. They had a long drawn out divorce and a few issues with family. And she ended up with a large settlement.

    when i first met him, he told me his name was something else, i found out his real name and put it down to his trust issues, he didn't tell me I was waiting for him to tell me in his own time. He introduced me to his work friends have so many contact numbers for him it really felt like I was a real part of his life. He prides himself on treating people so well, and said he would never do anything to hurt me, so how can this not have hurt me?

    I have got the message and am not contacting him anymore. I would have been receptive to anything he said. We could have just spoken a few times and then just drifted apart, if I am honest I was not sure if we were romantically suited. I like to think about things too. But I would never have hurt his feelings like this, especially knowing what he has been through in the past. He told me about a dream once he had of his ex wife squeezing his car, crushing it while he was watching, and telling him look how strong I am. He has only has one four month relationship since he divorced and prior to meeting me met a girl just twice before I guess disappearing on her like he has done on me.

    Erasing someone from your life generally means, you dislike them intensely, or just don't want to face up to something.

    It just feels sad because I lost someone I cared a great deal about and it feels like he doesn't care at all.

    I am virgo too, and I know when i want to walk away from someone I leave them with a happy note make it okay say goodbyes let them know why something happened. closure.

    He's shut me out, when this was all his doing. All I have tried to do is set it right to the way it was before.

    I'm never going to hear from him again and its sad because I miss him. I actually just want to be there for him as a friend, share in happiness etc even just from a peripheral angle.

    I had his back and would never have hurt him and was always putting brakes on things so it didn't end up like this.

    But in hindsight, I know he just can't trust himself to be happy again and there is nothing anyone can do he will just keep on running. when someone gets too close he will just run.

  • Hi,

    just to say whats happening.. I'm still confused, hitting my head in the wall constantly. That man is like my shadow.

    After all, he text me saying that I'm his mistake, that he loves his wife like the first day and that he want her like the first day, he feel terrible because he betrayed her... I said "I don't know why are you talking to me this?" I didn't contact him since my last post here...

    I really don't know why is he behaving like this? He thinks that now, when I'm alone, I want to be with him? Last night he send a text "I think we should stop this, we had our beautiful moments and now its time to stop, because you never were satisfied with me, you always criticized me".

    I can't believe! He thought that we are still together and now he is breaking? I'm in Twilight zone. So, I replied and joked "What a shame, I just wanted to call you to offer some s e x". He didnt replied. I was sarcastic.

    So, he didn't love me. Not a moment. Why I'm still thinking on him? Will he ever remeber me and the way he was rude? How to forget him?

    Jenever, what's going on with you Virgo?

  • 😞 he obviously was thinking about you hence his outburst,

    He just wanted to hurt you. Have the last say, confess his guilt.

    Your situation is very complicated, but i think main thing to remember is to look after yourself, carry on living.

  • Forevervirgo - That's so unfortunate, but it sounds like you are being very realisitic about things and at least you do seem to have some understanding of what has motivated his behavior. It's no comfort, I know, but really he is so NOT going to put himself into a relationship. That seems obvious and you seem to be accepting that, even if reluctantly. As I answer Leogemini's question next here, I will say that I am starting to just think these men are nuts, lol.

    So leogemini - Funny you would ask. Virgo and I are in quite a nasty argument right now. Rather I should say he is, I told him I'm not arguing. The trigger was plans for the weekend that apparently fell apart. I say "apparently" because he didn't bother to tell me. His excuse was legit, his vehicle broke down (it is also his work vehicle so this is important), but my issue is that he couldn't take two minutes to call or text me. So I, very diplomatically (I thought) explained to him in an e-mail that I wasn't going back to this same old pattern of making plans and then him leaving me hanging. That I asked for very little out of him. How after the last time we saw each other and had such a great time, that I really felt that we are on the same page. But it seems that we are not.

    I explained also that I understood the difficulties of his situation and being able to see me, but that he should understand the difficulties of it for me as well. Bottom line, I said that I at least expect him to be considerate of my feelings in all of this as well. All I asked for was a phone call or a text. If that's not possible, given all of his circumstances, then we need to rethink what we are doing, because I really am not going back down that same old path. (Does any of this sound familiar? I feel like deja vu here but I'm too lazy to scroll back through the thread.)

    Well, do you suppose he might have one shred of empathy for my feelings? Heck no, he went off on me like I dropped a bomb. Surely something I said hurt him to put him in such a rage (I know I've said many times, anger is always rooted in hurt). He completely missed the point, he went off on some tangent about me being rude and not having a clue what it takes for him to take care of his life, how I wanted everything my way, blah, blah, blah. It's not even worth rehashing it all because it was such a load of b.s. You folks know that I rarely see this man. I give him all the space in the world. Enough to live a whole life completely alien to me. Yet, my one request for him to take two minutes of he precious time to update me and he acts like I'm asking for his first-born. Good God, I didn't know whether to laugh or to be mad at him.

    The rage though, I am still just incredibly amazed at how awful he reacted over such a simple thing. I try to imagine the level of defensiveness bottled up in him that he is drawing this stuff from and what it has taken to get him there. What in the world could have happened. He's not a stupid man, he must know that I care about him. It's been two years since we met. I've had my issues with him, but I've never hurt him other than, times like this, when I am just trying to figure out the deal so that I'm not being left hurt either. I think that is fair and justified. Relationships with anyone are not supposed to leave you hurt. Friend, lover, family - it makes no difference.

    So anyway, I replied to this saying that I wasn't going to fight, that I didn't really understand his anger, that there is something really wrong if me expressing my feelings causes this kind of damage, and that he needed to put a little love in the mix and go back and reread what I was saying in that new light. Yeesh, I'm actually offering to get out of his life if this is how things are going to go, just so that I am not a thorn in his side. I also told him that I had tremendous respect for what it takes for him to run his business and take care of his family. That he should be proud of his accomplishments.

    What I think I'm seeing is a man who feels so unappreciated and whose self-esteem is so challenged that he is compelled to raging defensiveness even with me, and I'm guessing that I am probably one of the people who actually does appreciate him in his life. Can you imagine how he responds to those in his life who really do pick on him all the time? His wife? Extended family? I think back to a time when he said he needed me to "help him be better". I don't think there's enough of me to fix this guy if I'm on the right track.

    You know, there is a sweet and gentle man that lies buried beneath all of this. Not just this current incident, but all his lies and whatever other misdeeds I may be unaware of. I know he's in there because that's the man I always see when we are together. He relaxes with me. But I've known just as well that he has a temper. He let it slip just once with me and I could see that he caught himself very quickly. is there. Sometimes people can get a handle on that, and sometimes they can't. I do know he's anger issues since he was a child because he mentioned seeing counselors when he was in school. I'm still not beyond thinking that he has some genuine imbalance because a couple of times he has said things so outlandish that I wanted to ask him "did you forget to take your meds today" as a joke, but it may be no joke. Maybe he is bipolar or something given that he has a real history of anger problems.

    So it's sad in some ways isn't it. I honestly don't know what happens next. His complete inability to understand me, and rather than try to, he chose instead to just take offensive and and be hurtful well it leaves me cold. But the reality is, as long as he perpetuates his previous behavior and as long as he won't treat me with consideration, we truly are going to keep pushing back and forth on each other, each trying to maintain what we need. And what I've pointed out to him is that we really may have to face the fact here that we are in very different places in terms of what we need from each other. Told him that's not good or bad, right or wrong, just reality. Does it hurt me to come to that place? Yes, obviously it does, I've expended a lot of emotion on him. Spent a tremendous amount of time trying to understand him. It's unfortunate that it couldn't bring us any closer together, although I do know that we've both learned a few things about ourselves in all of this time.

    Anyway, I haven't checked my mail to see if has anything more to say. His usual response is to go into hermit mode and think things through before he responds. So it may take him some time. I would probably like to make a few more comments as my response to him was fairly brief because I was at work. But then I'm not sure what purpose it would serve if he is only going to see what he chooses to see in my words. So maybe just let that one go for a bit.

    Changing the subject back to you leogemini, your guy is certainly a piece of work as well. What a tangle of emotions must be playing through his mind. Isn't it incredible how things shake out when the truth is let into the light of day though? You know, he might actually love you in his own way, but this is who he is. You are now seeing it. You see the coward that your husband saw. (How is that going btw?) I think that it will get easier for you to get over him as you start to see more revealed now that you are not just listening to his loving words, now you are seeing the full picture.

    It certainly isn't a good day to be a Virgo man around here today is it! HiddenDiamond, if you are reading this, are you doing okay my friend? I think the planets are not in your favor this week, lol.

  • Thinking about all of you guys...since I am still surrounded by V's, thought I'd post the below, sounded interesting:

    V's are usually observant, shrewd, critically inclined, judicious, patient, practical supporters of the status quo, and tend toward conservatism in all departments of life. On the surface they are emotionally cold, and sometimes this goes deeper, for their habit of suppressing their natural kindness may in the end cause it to atrophy, with the result that they shrink from committing themselves to friendship, make few relationships, and those they do make they are careful to keep superficial.

    But the outward lack of feeling may, in some individuals born under this sign, conceal too much emotion, to which they are afraid of giving way because they do not trust others, nor do they have confidence in themselves and their judgments. This is because they are conscious of certain shortcomings in themselves of worldliness, of practicality, of sophistication and of outgoingness. So they bring the art of self concealment to a high pitch, hiding their apprehensiveness about themselves and their often considerable sympathy with other people under a mantle of matter-of-factness and undemonstrative, quiet reserve. They are still waters that run deep. Yet in their unassuming, outwardly cheerful and agreeable fashion, they can be sensible, discreet, well spoken, wise and witty, with a good understanding of other people's problems which they can tackle with a practicality not always evident in their own personal relationships.

    @Jenever, no matter how much you love someone, you should always treat others and be treated by others with kindness. Since love is a much stronger feeling... The definition of love: a strong positive emotion of regard and affection; a profoundly tender, passionate affection for another person; a feeling of warm personal attachment or deep affection. If this is the definition, clearly something is missing withing the relationship, if the significant other or we, are not acting in this manner. So all the excuses in the world do not make up for bad behavior, no matter how it is packaged.

    Rewarding bad behavior begets bad behavior. We are solely responsible for allowing another to mistreat us, once we acknowledge the mistreatment. If I were to mistreat you, you wouldn't be so eager to converse with me. In fact, you probably would not converse with me at all. This is such a simple answer, so what reason wd one accept less from another? Think about that for a moment... Is it loneliness? Afraid one cannot find another? Is V so good at making love, one cannot live without them? Is V emotionally or materially supportive? Or is it just comfortable? If we think about what it is that the V brings to our life, then it is a great deal easier to decide whether one wants to accept being treated poorly or not. At my age, being treated poorly isn't an option. If V or any many does not treat you right, then there are a great many men that will.

    All the ladies on this forum are beautiful, intelligent and special; and should be treated as such. Of couse, we must treat others in the same regard.

    Wishing everyone a great day.

  • Jenever, your Virgo is angry because you told him that he could send you a text or call you? Shame on you! You could use telepathy or cristal ball to see that his vehicle is broken down... I'm just kidding...I guess you will be punish for the next few days or maybe a week or two... After that, he will be back... You know him and don't lost your nerves...

    Forevervirgo, it's unfair when someone cut all the contact without reason, without explain, like your Virgo did. So many questions to ask...But I think you will find out what was the reason. His loss...

    My soon-to-be ex husband is my best friend. I lost miserable husband, but I have a very good friend now who loves me and support me. For the environment in which we live, it's a shock. But we were and we still are the pioneers in social and personal relations here... My mother told me that I always take the road which is harder to cross...

    How to deal with jealousy? After all he told me about his perfect wife, about his tremendous guilt and how he betrayed her... theres nothing left of my self-confidence... Their children are not here for two weeks, they are alone and all I can do is imagine him kissing her, new honeymoon... everything is perfect... They live two floors above... My husband told me that I worth more than both of them (but thats friends say, right?)

    Aries BB, I keep asking myself, what did I get from him? Nothing, only pain. Why am I so sad then? Is it me? Maybe he is the "normal" one in this relation?

  • Sorry Jenever V will always be V. @ Leogemini you inspire me everyday I come here and read your story. ABB you uplift us everyday you blog.

    So here is my story. Towards the end of 2010 V n I were communicating very seldomly. I wanted clarity and asked him what he wanted and where we were? Obviously, being a confused creature, his answer was " we should keep communicating and see where this goes." He went cold. So I tried and tried to get closure. Well, I decided to have a very close friend talk to him. This is so funny as I have come to realize that he is a lost child.

    Apparently he's been angry and holding a grudge because I dropped him out of face book. He asked to her to come and ask me why I dropped him out of FB. The irony is we've spoken several times and he's never mentioned that he was upset. Now I have learnt one thing he likes to control and proved otherwise. He uses the excuse that he's a Muslim and Religion plays a big part on who he dates. My question was he knew I wasn't a Muslim when he got with me. How silly. Well he's a man first and I have come accept that he's got lots and lots of issues to deal with. Today I feel less burdened, my chest is lighter and my stomach is not sick or full of emotions. Well he said he's open to friendship. I suggested that and received a cold shoulder. He's yet to finish talking to her and give her his opinion. As I told her he betrayed me and I don't see my self going back. He will never be the same person I fell for. The man am dealing with is a total stranger from Congo forest. I will be his friend from far. I do not want to be sacked back into his confusion and web of lies. I have managed to detangle myself and nothing will pull me back. Thank you ladies you've all supported me. Each one of you holds a very special place. This is the only place I can pour my heart and not feel judged. I will keep up with the blog. I will keep you updated. Hugs and kisses.

  • closure.

    Thats nice to have, say goodbyes understand and then be left a lone to get better 😉 and await someone who can offer us everything not just little snippets.

    Maybe the women thats V's choose to 'string along' they can see that they will take it. Otherwise they would be not so callous to treat people that care about them this way.

  • Well, what can I say, my worst side got the better of me and I responded to V with a slew of ridiculous points about him in response to how he reacted to me. At the end I asked how does it feel to get hit with an angry rant? I said, " actually I feel surprisingly young - a bit like a bratty 14-year-old!" Naturally I thought this was very funny. Naturally he did not. I just made him more mad.

    I was told that he was generally in no mood for me and my "childish" behavior and "pouting". Then on the flip side he said he didn't owe me any explanations, that I should stop trying to figure things out, that I was "like having a mother". And then, he told me that I was welcome to e-mail him any time but that if it wasn't nice then ten words into it he was going to delete the rest without reading it. And finally he pointed out that if I were not going to be nice to him that I could expect more of the same. That I needed to back off. Said that he never said mean things to me unless he were provoked first (apparently my asking him to have some accountability and communicate, and care about my feelings too, was provoking him). And I loved the last line, "kindness will give you a gentle response". Oh yeah, and "he's not mad he's just not dealing with this". Big dang surprise that is, I think the only thing he can deal with is his work. You can avoid the whole world if you just keep working.

    So I replied that I needed to think about all this. That his response and reaction to me was so far off the original point of my first e-mail, that I felt like this on it's own should be telling me something. I also pointed out that if he believes that "kindness begets kindness, then what did he expect when he reacted to me in anger?" His response to all this was snotty. "Go ahead, meditate on it and analyze it and see what you come up with...this should be interesting".

    So I did think about it and tried to get outside of it and understand what all of his ridiculousness was about and I just couldn't see it. What I had said to him was honest, it was not intended to hurt, although the idea of ending things is probably somewhat hurtful, but if he cared about that he should have called. If he cared about that he could have taken a more positive approach to my being upset, but "no", being asked to care makes him angry. I think that to him my concerns seem petty, but given that this is the never-ending pattern for him, it is not a small thing. Given all the conversation we've had over the issue of communication, it is not a small thing. Why is it such a difficult concept for him to understand this. Either he doesn't want to or he really is doing the best he can and can't get there. Which led me to the next thought and my last response to him, and that was simply, "we are too far apart in age".

    We live in a parallel universe as far as our lives, our children are the same ages, things we value are generally the same, we're both reasonably intelligent people, strong work ethics, etc. and yet somehow we always reach a disconnect where we are both asking ourselves, "how do you just NOT get me?" And all I could finally see is that the reason he finds me mothering is the same reason that I have so many times said to myself, "my God I feel like I'm dealing with a child!" It's because we're feeling the same thing but from two ends of the spectrum. (I'm sure that got him plenty ruffled up, he like to think of himself as being very manly. Manliness does not make a real man though does it. Maturity makes the man.) Just to refresh your memories here, V and I are 15 years apart. Oh I know, like the whole "affair" thing and his complicated personality aren't enough, we have a wide age difference as well. It's a regular trifecta of relationship challenge we've had going.

    But there was that realization and it really feels to me that this is a part of what is wrong between us. I told him that he was right, I probably really was more like a mother to him than anything else. He had made a statement to me that he "finds it so hard to understand how intelligent I can be at times and how childish I can be at others". I remarked that this is the very same way I feel about him. That he seems so smart and yet just as quickly he's got me pulling my hair out over issues that to me seem so freaking obvious. And when I put this all together it's like we're seeing the same thing between us just from two different perspectives. So I said I'm not going to apologize for who I am, any more than he was obviously not going to apologize for who he is. Told him I have no desire to try to see the world from the perspective of a 35 year old again. I'm not going backwards. And for all the times I've asked myself, "why can't this man ever just meet me in the middle", maybe the answer is that the "middle" is years of experience ahead of him, and for me to get to that place with him is years of water under the bridge for me.

    Well, I haven't heard anything more from him of course. That was two nights ago, I'm sure I've put him in some kind of emotional stress overload and besides, he's says he's "not dealing with this" anyway. Very mature isn't it. Great problem-solving skills. But see, that's just my point. The amount of immaturity that just keeps coming into play here. His accusation that I'm being a pouty child, when the real pouty child is him if I ever question him . His angry reaction to me was totally juvenile and self-involved. He tries to make me out to be selfish and mean, but that's totally dillusional given our situation. I have given him miles of rope and yet still he hangs himself because he is the one who is selfish and ready to make me feel like dirt if I question him. I am sure that the only way I keep forgiving him is out of my maturity and mothering nature, lol.

    So ladies, I may need some encouragement here. I need this to be the end of all this nonsense. I know that should be easy, but of course it's not. I expect he's going to take plenty of space here for a while and I don't want to cave in any more with feeling bad about things and contacting him. Nor do I want to have him come back acting like nothing happened, or tell me that he's cooled down now (like it's a priviledge for me that he's even speaking to me), and ready to lure me back in with his "charms".

    He clearly wants me to feel like I am messed up and being mean and causing all the problems, but it's all a lie. He's the one who is insensitive. He chooses the most extreme negative perspective he can find from anything I say to him. If there were an ounce of love in him he would try to see my side of things, but he doesn't. And maybe he'd really rather just see things come to an end now anyway. Maybe I'll never even hear from him again, but just in case.....I need to get myself positioned emotionally to resist any more of his games. Man, we just went through all of this I can't believe we're right there again. With him blaming me and totally unable to see what little it would take to keep us out of this place. Which probably says that he likes this "place" between us just fine, as he does nothing to improve things himself.

    Okay, I'll probably be back. We know how up and down it is getting out of our emotions with these guys. I'm good now but I know there will be low points as it all sinks in.

  • Jenever am so sorry...You have done your part. You can never force anyone to love you or want you. They have to want to. I have learned that through dealing with V. You are the stronger one here and I trust you will be okay. Take heart it's a long journey ahead. The big question here is? Why were V's brought into our lives? What lessons were they supposed to teach us or what are they supposed to learn from us? They say that people that we meet are a mirror which is a reflection to something. I remember when I approached V about his going to CA without telling me he gave me the same message your V did. It's a defensive mechanism to make you feel guilty and that you are the problem and not them. Until V can realize and accept that he has a problem and that he needs to deal with it, then you and him will always be back and forth. I realized that when I my friend spoke with V on my behalf. His arrogance was annoying..this is what he told her "You know my name is A" his name starts with an A. To me that was just total arrogance and he doesn't seem to realize that. Any how he will hold a grudge and expect you to apologize as V is still waiting for the reasosn why I dropped him out of my face book list. Will I be apologizing for that? Nope I am a better place today than I was yesterday. They say in Swahilli, " Mjinga akielevuka, mweruvu you mashakani." In English (direct interpretation) when a stupid person becomes clever, the clever one is in trouble." V need to stop manipulating and take responsibility here he's a 35 and a father.

    Girlfriend were are here for. I don't know how you feel about him or how deeper your feeling are. Just follow your heart. If you feel it's worthy the energy and effort then go for it. I guess the big question here is are you happy with V? You are the only one who can answer those questions. Though you know we are here for you. Take time and think about it. You have encouraged us so much and, I where I am now because of you. You will be okay one day at a time. Don't bottle emotions it make it worse. Express them however you feel. Always remember "It's OKAY to express yourself anyway you choose." Whether it means blowing of on V ( I did that and I always felt better." Hugs and kisses.

  • Jenever, I am so sorry for his behavior. He is mean now. I think that when someone gets so mad it's because you told him the truth that he can't face with. At this moment. Nice of him when he said that he is mean only when you are mean first... What about his bad behavior that provoked you to be "mean" to him? He wants kindness? Well, I think you were kind for the past two years and I can't say that for him!

    For now you must leave him to think about his behavior. And you - think about how he upset you, making you selfish and mean, childish, for no reason... Is this love? It's not suposed to look like this! Cut all contact, if you are strong, he don't deserve anything from you. Now, I'm mad!

    I think that we are all here for you. You must be strong now. I hug you from the other side of Earth.

  • Kk33 - thanks for your thoughtful words. So interesting that you would say something about why these guys were brought into our lives. I've thought about this so much the past couple of days because I do believe there's purpose in all of the relationships that come and go in our lives. Sometimes it's for a personal lesson - that refelction on ourselves, but just as often I think it's literally to move you to a new physical place or show you an opportunity that you couldn't have found otherwise. So I look at all of this and I know that I was not "lost" emotionally when V found me. I was in the right place for me, on a good path for me, and all of that aspect of life has continued in spite of his emotional distractions. So I ask myself did his coming into my life open some door that I'm overlooking? And you know what, it actually did, it opened this door. And just to hear you say that me coming here, and creating a space for so many others who have inspired me as well, that is a door that never would have opened were it not for this V coming along and complicating my life.

    I hate to talk about him like he's the past already. I know that all I would have to do is grovel, and tell him how sorry I am, and tell him that I am wrong and we could just stay right in this place where everything works perfectly for him among the rest of his imperfect world. But I'm not feeling sorry because I have no reason to and there is nothing I've said to him that I think is wrong, other than I'm saying things that he doesn't want to deal with. It's "wrong" of me to bring things up that he doesn't want to confront. That's what he is finding wrong with me and for me, that is what is wrong with him. The very reason he found me in the beginning was because of all the truths that he doesn't want to confront in his own life. I think I've known this all along, but wondered if he would find the courage to face things and make the changes he needs for himself. He has seemed so close at times...but it is too hard for him. So I see more clearly now that the answer is "no".

    Did I mention that his last e-mail to me was one little sentence, "I'm not mad at you, just not going to deal with this". The door remains open, but you see his message is very clear - I will be dealt with only in a way that suits him. At some level I think this isn't him being an outright jerk, but more that he's probably at a threshold where he can't add anything more. He didn't have to be mean to let me know that of course, but maybe it's the only way he knows how to handle it. As always, I make excuses for him, lol, but I tend to do that with everyone I guess. We all have our dark sides and I'm sure there will be a few more moments in all of this that thinking about him and our history pulls me into mine, but that's why I'm so glad to have all my friends here to keep me out of that place. 🙂 Thank you!

  • Leogemini - You are such a sweetheart, now don't be mad on my account! Thank you for those reminders. Yes indeed he provoked me with his behavior and he would have to be a complete idiot not to know that I was going to be upset. Again, this is my point. He could have prevented any sort of confrontation by simply acting like a caring, responsible man in the first place, but he chose not to. This distance is what he wants and he is going to get it even if it hurts me, but at the same time it's as if he doesn't really want me to go too far.

    Of course that was all before I turned the tables with the age thing. I am outright telling him that we are not at the same stage of experience or maturity and I am not going to try to understand him anymore. He wants to accuse me of acting like his mother, I say "yes, you are right!" Now he should hopefully think about why someone who is significantly older than him always feels compelled to treat him like a child. Virgos like their facts, there is the fact. Call me a child all you want and it still can never make me one, the years speak for themselves, lol. Is "mothering" him all the time childish on my part then? Will he see that he is the one acting like a child and prompting that kind of reaction? Who knows, but getting to this understanding has been very helpful to me.

    It's just so interesting to me that he can see that "kindness brings kindness" but he can't see how "anger brings anger" or "childishness brings childishness" and I've always tried to respond to him with maturity in the hope that eventually "maturity would inspire maturity". As you say, leogemini, I have dug to the depths of my soul to stay on the high road with this man and offer him kindness and compassion. But I am going to try very hard to hold your thought to cut contact. He wants to be a part of my life, but he doesn't want to bring anything good into it, unless I put the good in him first. The ridiculous thing is that I don't bring bad into his life! It would be one thing if I were a witch of a woman truly causing him pain and making him miserable. Maybe I would have earned his anger, but I KNOW that I am not. And what I ask from him is not unreasonable, it's pretty normal. I think that basically he's in a situation where he craves love and support but the man in him wants to solve his problems himself. I solve my problems in life without any man at all, lol, so it probably is pretty unhelpful to offer him any of my insights on life. Not doing much for his manly self-esteem to have a woman tell him the answers. That's what moms do! Ha! It's like dam it woman, just give me love and let me handle the rest of it my way. Which would all be just fine if he were considerate of me in return.

    Thanks for being there for me leogemini! All hugs received and most welcome!

  • Jenever, you must hold on. You don't want to be in my situation. Withdraw while it's time. After, it will be worst. For my V. I am a mistake now, a guilty woman who was bad to her family and threat to his own. He don't want to see me. He is angry. Why? I don't know.

    Please, keep your pride and don't contact him. You offer him love and kindness, you are trying to underrstand him... And him? Beeing a Virgo or not, he didn't show you his respect in the first place. And what about his love?

    Don't be angry at me, I just wish that I was smarter. I don't want you to be for a few months or years like me, without self-respect, thinking about where did you go wrong...


  • Maybe we should rename this thread into "Our heart after Virgo man"?

  • Hi Everyone, my situation was similar with a Virgo, too. he travels a lot and took a long

    time to get intimate and then too little. I was thinking that did not like me physically. He says he does love me, but it feels so sterile at times. I am becoming a nag because i am not sure if he seeing anyone of his business trips, what can i do. I have been out of a relationship for a long while and not used to how it all works anymore.

    His trips are causing me distress, am i waiting for naught, loosing a real change for love with some one else? But how can i look around if he says he love me and speaks so long term? A part of me is so worried after so many years in a loveless marriage (long story),

    don't wish to ever do that again. This is sort of a rant, sorry, really confused. Any insight would be helpful.

  • Leogemini - Too funny "Heart after a Virgo Man". I like it! And I could never, ever be mad at you for anything you have to say. I need to hear what you have to say right now.

    So far I have stood firm, but it hasn't been easy. Sometimes I want to send him a message and just vent, and other times I think about his good side and want to make things right, but between the two I have managed to just stay away. It's not about being smart, you are smart, it's just emotional. It is about self-respect though, and I think that I have enough that it's probably why we keep getting into this negative place anyway. You probably have more than you realize as well, because that's what kept you questioning your Virgo. As long as we kept pushing against them dragging us down, then we have conflict. Giving up your self-respect completely is the only thing that seems to suit them.

    I can tell you that's exactly what my V was up to. There could be no other reason for his anger than to make me feel bad and to make me afraid of losing him. Do you know he said to me, "go back and read your e-mails to me then look yourself in the mirror, and if you feel okay about yourself then great! If not, I am still here". That's when he said , "if you are kind you will get a gentle response". Well after all the other stuff he said, why should I care what I see in my own mirror, I figured I needed to take a look at what I was looking at in him!

    His final thought to me seems to be, give me what I want and you are welcome in my life. Really? I should have to change myself to be a part of his world? This is the part that keeps bringing me back to my center right now. This man, who can't sort out his own life thinks I need to change something? I never asked him to change, I only asked him to call me, lol. I guess that would be a pretty big change after two years of him operating the way he wants. Maybe I am a selfish, demanding woman. Ha!

    So you just keep talking to me leogemini, because you know how this goes, up and down. You feed me your "tough love" so I can keep it up at my end, lol. But it has been funny the past two days I keep getting "messages". I was behind a man in line yesterday and he was wearing a sports team shirt, on the back it had printed: "Suffer today and live as a champion the rest of your life". Then, this might sound silly, but everyday I eat Dove brand chocolates. Inside the wrapper it always has an inspiring little message. Today I opened three in a row that said, "Be fearless". Then, I read my horoscope here on after work today and it says, " If you recently acquiesced to an authority figure, now it's time to pull in the reins and reassert control of your life. Finally, it's your turn to play the role of the fearless leader; your failure to step up to the plate and claim your power will leave room for someone less qualified to take charge. Fortunately, you can act with compassion, so there's no need to be critical of anyone. It's crucial to seize the moment, stand up for yourself and state your beliefs. If you don't do it, no one else will."

    Being fearless seems to be the message of the day! And then you, leogemini, saying "withdraw while it's time". I think it must really be time!

    Thank you for caring enough, and trusting me enough, to speak your mind to me leogemini, I appreciate you very much.

  • Confussion 8 - Nice to have you here. I'm wondering how long you've been involved with this man? You say he is talking "long term". What does that look like to him? Does he get specific about his plans with you or just leave it as "...someday"?

    What concerns me is that he is causing you enough distress that you are asking yourself if you are "losing a real chance for love with someone else". If you can have a conversation with this man and get the answers that you need to make you feel secure about the relationship, then that's what you need. If he can't have that kind of conversation, then you might want to think about what you are waiting for. The danger in having lived a long time in a loveless marriage is that it can change your expectations. You don't sound like you're getting what you want out of this relationship, but compared to what you were used to, it probably seems like more - yet it is turning out not to be enough based on what you say. I think that perhaps you have not found the kind of man you really want in this man.

    I guess the amount of time you've been involved is part of this. If it is not very long, then maybe you give him some time. If it has been a while and this distress of yours is growing, then it may be time to think about how much more time and emotion you want to invest in him. Just because he says he loves you, those words mean nothing if he leaves you feeling unloved and uncertain.

    Lots of us here for you if you'd like to talk about this more. We all know what it's like to feel confused! Hugs to you!

  • Jenever, I know it's not easy. But, stay away this time. Yes, you can... I know how it looks when you making excuses for him, when you understand him and don't get mad at him although he deserve that. No, you are thinking about your own mistakes and why did you said that, do this... Like he puts all his guilt on you. Like I said, you don't want to be in my place. He avoid me and I avoid him. I don't even want to talk what's in my head and heart, like I don't want anybody to disturb my sorrow now. Keep your dignity and pride and make one step forward. No texts and no e-mails...

    He wants you to feel bad and he knows that you are afraid of losing him. Well, he is the one who should be afraid of losing you. Let HIM think about his mistakes and let him miss you. A month or two or maybe more... But, let him go. Don't be afraid. Fearless, remember?

    Just think that you can't change his thoughts now. If he loves you, he will come back. If he don't, your text or e-mail can't change anything. Just cut your every thought that excuses him.

    Look at your relationship as a separate entity from his marriage. Did your relationship failed regardless to his marriage? Just look at you two, your relation. Is that what you need? You are a good, smart, beautiful woman who needs a strong and reliable man. With your V. you must measure your every word just not to insult him. Does he think about not insulting you or did he insult you with his behavior and his words?

    Listen to your "messages" and walk away. Fearless.

    I am here for you, strong in some moments... maybe next day I will not be so strong... Then you will be there to support me...

    Confussion, we don't know the whole story... What advice to give? If you feeling unloved maybe you could tell him that. Talk to him and tell him how you feel. Don't nag. If he don't understand you and your needs - time to move on.


Log in to reply