The heart of a Virgo man
Mardepp, my heart goes out to you! Heed VS's insight! I've mentioned many times that Virgos make the rules and if you choose to be in a relationship with a Virgo, it's a must that you play by those rules. If not, you're going to have a very difficult and roller coaster type ride Some women like my daughter (Pisces) have no problem as long as materially Virgo treats her well and she keeps herself very busy with other things. Guess there is nothing wrong with this type of arrangement if both partners treat each other with respect and are happy since the grass is not always greener on the other side and relationships are a lot or work. Bottom line is, you do not seem to be very happy with the situation as is and you probably just got comfortable with neglecting your needs. Take time out for yourself and always remember when a person tells you something, believe them, they know themselves better than anyone else. Virgo is not ready and he has told you so, doesn't matter why he is not ready, he just is not ready!
G4E, hope you're not still feeling lonely. I'm sure it will not last since as you mentioned probably just the time of the month.
Jenever, do you think that your readiness to reach out to Virgo has something to do with Aries disappearance in your life?
VS, How has everything been going with your employment situation and do you see moving out in your near future? Wishing you good fortune soon!
Sahana, welcome back!
Well ladies, this thread has grown so big I probably have missed a great deal of information myself. Anyway, have a great day ladies and gents and wishing everyone finds themselves in a better place today!
Thank you ABB, I did that for a long time and I was ok with it. But it just got to a point for me that what he would identify as growth for me was just a mirage. So, I understand and I told him so. He is capable and aware because he has shown me both. I am strangely doing very well. I have sadness at times but I am more relaxed and my stress level has gone down. Enjoying a beautiful sunny day.
Hope you are all doing the same thing wherever you are.
AriesBB - I think that Aries disappearance in my life had more to do with my unreconciled feelings in my heart about Virgo, and really seeing that there wasn't enough going on there to push Virgo out of my heart. I really do believe that if a guy came along that stirred the right feelings in me, that I would not overlook that - I would embrace that. I think that Ariesman is a really good guy, but I think that for what we do have in common, there were some other - more long term considerations that I feel we don't have in common. Since neither one of us is running back to the other - I haven't heard from him at all - I believe he sees this as well. He is not a stupid man. To some extent too, I think he is still processing his feelings for his ex wife. I think that our "fun" times together often felt forced. Best I know how to explain it.
And, as far as Virgo's return, I just accept that this is all playing out now how it needs to for me to tie up my emotional loose ends and accept some change. I don't want to elaborate here on all that has transpired with Virgo these past couple of weeks because frankly, I'm weary already of more of the same with Virgo. Just read back through the thread and it would just be a new version of the same old cycles. I think that your statement is true that when people tell you who they are, then that is all there is. I'm now attempting to do the work on myself to sort the mixed emotions that Virgo has brought back into my life. He is going to do whatever he wants and whatever suits himself at this time. That is no different than before. He seems to believe that if I am his friend, then I should understand and accept this. As I look at things, this is no different that looking out on anyone in the world and saying, "look at everyone just living their lives and it is of no consequnce to me personally". That is reality and a perfect normal and fine reality. Those multitudes of strangers are not my friends though, they are just people out there in life.
What is missing in what Virgo seems to want is any genuine interaction. The give and take. Aside from the fact that Virgo has made no effort to see me since he "returned", and the opportunities that he did have to see me revealed the same patterns as the man I knew a year ago - white lies, avoidance, disrespect of my feelings - what he has also NOT been doing is talking about me. I pointed out to him in a recent string of texts where I was venting, that he has, not once, asked me about my life. A year has passed and he hasn't asked me at all how my life has gone. While I understand the complications of his life, we ALL have complications in our lives. That's why we have our friends, to share the good times and to help us through the difficult ones. He always wants me to be on the sidelines of his difficult times, but he is not there for me. Even him coming back into my life, is a challenge for me. He HAD to have known this was going to be hard on me and hard for me. I told him as much. Rather than participate in helping me understand and get through the emotions to a different place, he walls me off with things like, "my kids will always come first in my life" as if he has no time for my feelings. Me and my feelings are not more important than his martyr mission that has always put his children before his own feelings or anyone else's. That is the lack of balance in him that has brought us to this place from day one. I adore my children, I want nothing but the best for them, but sacrificing my personal happiness does not bring more to them, it takes away from what I can offer them, and, it is not what they want. They want me to be happy, they encourage me to be social, have friends, try new things, even find a man - if that's what will make mom happy, lol.
It is a great burden to leave your kids thinking that they are the sole source of your happiness and what I believe Virgo will find one day is that when his children move on to find their own happiness, there will be a great hole in his heart. The one he never learned how to fill because he put all of his heart in one place, he never learned that a heart is infinite and there is always room for one more. But learning that lesson means giving your heart freely to others that you care for. Showing them. Maybe he is too afraid, or maybe he really just doesn't know how.
Anyway, I have come to the place that it's not my job to try to show him anything anymore. No one sees anything until they are ready. We all know that too well here on this thread. I don't love him any less today than I did through all time, but it's time to accept that he doesn't understand what I am saying to him. If he does, he still can't or won't do anything with it. It's like he wants nothing from me and at the same time he wants my unconditional acceptance of how he is and what he does. That, my friends, when you look at what it really means, pretty much makes him a stranger at this point. As I said before, the world is full of strangers going about living their lives and bringing nothing significant to my life, nor I to their lives. We just coexist.
So I repeat - a relationship is about give and take. Right now I feel that he is a bleed on my emotions. It is once again a one-way street. If he can bring something of more substance to my life than what he has in the past - bring some real joy and friendship instead of dumping his pain on my doorstep and running off - then I am open here. But my current position is that I have told him from my heart how I feel and where I stand. I've done my best to support him through troubled times - even at the expense of my own feelings and happiness. The truth is right there and there's nothing more I have to say to him until he indicates that he wants something new and different between us. I can't accept any more of what has gone before and I don't have any more to give him. I am tapped out until, and unless, he contributes to building that back up.
He can be a martyr his whole life if that's all that suits him, and in my opinion it will continue to leave him empty and seeking. If he needs a martyr as a partner, if that's what it takes is someone to love him unconditionally while his heart is invested completely in something else, well, that's not me. I told him that I believed in him when he said to me, "you hold my heart in your hands". I took that seriously. I tried. Now, I have made the decision that I am not the keeper of his heart and that is between him and God now. He put a burden on me that was wrong. He is the caretaker of his heart and in control of where he puts it and how he expresses what is in it. What he asks of me right now is to be who he needs me to be - period - nothing to support who I am or what I need.
I told him that he always leaves me feeling that I have no choice but to walk away. There is always something that stands between us; his marriage, his kids, his damaged self - there is always some wall that I can't reach beyond for him to see my feelings in all of this. Basically I told him that trying to remain friends might just be too hard on both of us. The truth is, I'm not sure what is there as friends anyway when this is all about him living his life with me just on the sidelines or on the other side of a wall.
As I say, more of the same. I keep reciting Einstein's definition of insanity (which I have posted here at least once before) and paraphrased is: "continuously repeating the past and expecting different results". This past is done for me. I'm not putting up a wall, but I'm drawing a line in the sand that says, "if you want anything more with me you have to bring something over to my side for a change". If he truly can't be a giving person and has nothing to offer me back, there is nothing here really anyway. I have been there all along for him. Does he owe me anything for that? I suppose the answer is "not really". That was my choice. I told him he needs to decide if he wants me in his life.
So I spilled all that was in my heart these past few days and what I got in return was a text yesterday that said, "hope you are having a nice day". I don't know if that was him laughing at me and my "drama", or was it some message to say, "I hear you but I'm not dealing with this right now", or maybe it is nothing more than "have a nice day" I am not thinking of anything you have said at all. So I'm done wondering what anything to do with him means. I didn't respond and I don't think I ever will be able to bring myself to respond. If he wants me to understand, if he wants anything more between us, well I figure he's a grown man and he can figure it out and make the effort to help me understand. I am sad that it has come to this, I had hoped that we could have something different, I certainly have a lot invested in this man emotionally, but this seems to be all there is for us unless he changes. I can't do what he is doing and ask him to be what I want. If he's not what I want in a freindship or a deeper relationship then I have to trust myself. Which I admit is now easier since he took back all that hate he dumped on me a year ago. I guess his return isn't all bad in that respect.
Anyway, that's where things stand - which is nowhere when you really look at it. I feel that this past week was an opportunity for Virgo to show his true colors. There was space for something new between us and he closed the door more by his behavior than by anything that was actually said - because as I know all too well, his words mean nothing as they come out of his own confusion. Now I'm gradually feeling more energized by the idea of creating something new for myself, and just trying to stay away from feeling there is anything lost in all of this. That there is now more to be gained from new things and new people coming into my life. If he wants to show up in my life new and sparkling, well great, but that's not my worry anymore. He can stay in his rut as long as it suits him. I expect that being a Virgo man, that could be a very long time...
Hi girls. How are you all ? .. I missed you guys Jen, Voply, Gemini , Snowball and others. I thought , I'll never return to this thread because of what was going on in here but then again I missed you all. I was too busy these days ......I forgot my password so I have to create a new account lol..
Virgo x is trying to be friendly once again but I'm cautious this time, I've an old no & my virg x contacted me through that one.. He is calling me , texting me again and trying to vent about his problems(never ending problems) , at the same time he is trying his best to manipulate me (mind games started again). I 'm taking everything very lightly as we all know what these virgo men are capable of doing.. He is trying to be over friendly but at the same time non-committal. He has not changed a bit & still obsessed with his x..What he doesn't know is that, I've really moved on emotionally (too bad for him). He thought that I'm still waiting around for him so that he can play with my head once again and thus the cycle will continue until he dies.He can't fool me again.
Have a good day Ladies //// Hugs
Well Jen, Mardepp and CC, you all sound great and it appears you're moving in a new direction! Kudos!
Have a great day ladies! Hugs
ABB, my employment situation is still the same - I'm fully employed, but not paid, along with the rest of the teachers. It's a strange situation - everybody's saying that money's coming any moment, yet it's been almost 3 months without paiment. I think at the beginning of November I'll make it known that I'm looking for another working place. Unfortunately, meanwhile I'll have to start borrowing money from my Virgo friend (unless they pay pretty soon), and only after that I can afford putting my place into condition for living there.
CC, nice to hear from you. It looks like you've got the Virgo's number and are being strong. Good for you ! As always, just want to remind everybody, that Virgo men are a sophisticated bunch, and they know how to put a woman back on their hook, so we need to be very vigilant and be in touch with our will power more or less all the time, while they are still around.
Yes those Virgos are tricky. The lastest update on mine: He sent me an email saying that he was still in love with me but I'm too blind to see it. Hmmm; doesn't call, text, haven't seen him in over a month; yes I guess I'm pretty blind. But what I'm not is stupid if he thinks I'm falling for this...lol!
G4E, what you could do, if you really wanted to make him see how ridiculous this is, is to state the same - that he is too blind to see that you still care about him. But then again- maybe it's better to just let things be, as interaction would lead to another turn of a spiral...How is your new work ?
Yes I do still care about him and yes he is blind to that. But I did send him an email back asking if this is so, then blah, blah blah? I also asked him a host of other questions. He responded that he was working on stuff for his Master's program but that he would address all my concerns later today. We'll see what he says.
My new job is great! The people were very welcoming and I'm loving it so far. I have a sense of peace now that Virgo isn't right down the hall for me to bump into now and then. It's lovely!
Aries had also called me again a few weeks ago. He said he was miserable not talking to me. Everything was good until he got upset with something I said and swore not to speak to me again. Once again he called back saying he missed me. Well last night was the last straw for me with him. He called me but then commenced to carrying on a side conversation with his brother. I responded calmly asking him to call me back if he had to discuss something with his brother. He kept doing it so I repeated what I said. He got upset and we got off the phone. Don't you know he started texting me mean comments! I got fed up and told him "real classy" and obviously he's not used to dealing with a woman of my caiber and perhaps he should lose my number. He called me a few choice names to which I just lol and said he was angry and should get over himself. I told him I was done with him for good. I have a feeling he will call me back and try to apologize but I'm not accepting it. I'm really appalled at his behavior as I didn't deserve it and I don't deal with people who act as he did. I think he's upset because I have had to tell him more than twice that I was not interested in anything romantic with him. He seemed ok with that but now I think he wasn't, otherwise he wouldn't get so upset with me over every trivial matter. Oh well, I tried...
How are you doing? And ladies if you're reading this; please stop by to say hello every now and then! Enjoy the rest of this lovely Sunday!
Just stopping in to say Hi....I just found the thread again, thought it was gone forever, which would have been really rude of the Admin...lol!!
I will go back, read and catch up now!!
Have a great evening!!
Gemini 4 Ever,
Hi there! I told you it was not over between Virgo and you! Now he is force to say something because he knows he will not cross paths with you at work!
All is fairly well post Virgo for me. Trying to work a lot and trying to focus on the good things and grateful...
Hope the week starts well for everyone!
Hey Gem, you said to stop in and say "hi"
I continue to speak to Virgo but I'm at a loss right now. Things are not going well with his divorce, lots of battles, custody issues are a real sore point and the whole thing is a major low point in his life. I'm trying to put my feelings aside and be a friend, but those feelings are there. We haven't seen each other yet, he admits he is avoiding this, doesn't want any more to think about than what's in front of him. Doesn't want to drag me into his messes (I believe we're about three years too late on that one) and doesn't want to stir up emotions (little too late on that one too). I'm trying to respect his circumstances but I have told him repeatedly that I want to see him. He says there's a very good chance he will move away if things don't work out the way he needs them to with regards to his children. If it comes to that I definitely want to see him before he goes. He couldn't understand that until I explained that I needed it to feel resolution from the way things were left a year ago. A respectful ending instead of a bunch of drama and hate.
Did I say "ending"? Well, you know how these "endings" go with Virgo, but he said something that cut pretty deep this week, said that if he can't see his kids there is nothing here for him. That's not really true, he has family here. Even if he can't see them the way he would like, his children are here. But obviously what hurt me with that statement is the fact that I am here. Maybe in the compartmentalized mind of a Virgo man that wasn't what he meant, but the reminder of how these guys do compartmentalize emotions has also reminded me of how difficult dealing with that can be - how alienating.
Anyway, still don't know where things will really go here. Just wait and see. Seems all I've ever done in the time that I've known this man is wait on him to figure something out. Very much pushing me away and yet pulling me in at the same time. Reminds me of a fisherman when he has a big fish on the line; let a little line out, then reel it in, let some line out, reel it in, wearing that fish down...but sooner or later you have to decide if you really want that fish or you're going to risk letting it get off the hook.
Hello All! Good to see everyone stop in! LOL!
Yes you did say things aren't over for Virgo and I. He won't let it be and neither will I. Everytime I make up my mind where I'm at peace w/o hearing from him he pops back up. I haven't seen him since I left my old job and when I promise to sever things with us for good he comes back with he's still in love with me but I'm too blind to see it. I'm amazed at the things he will say when he thinks I'm really serious about not being in his life anymore. I don't care what he says but am going to continue putting the distance between us. I was serious when I made him the promise that this time was it. So he came up with something he thought would pull me back. I have to admit it almost worked. But as I've said before, and so as he--actions speak louder than words. A man in love would not go a month w/o seeing me. We would go weeks w/o talking except occasionally bumping into each other at the job (can't do that now thank goodness!). He doesn't call or text and I've grown used to it. My stance is if he wants me he'll have to come get me. Prove that he loves me by showing me. I'm prepared to wait until that happens--or not. I refuse to be the initiator. If he gives I'll give. I can wait. In the meantime if I meet someone and it "clicks", it'll be his loss. I'm prepared for him never coming for me; I don't have faith in him or his supposed love for me. I'm glad you're doing well post-Virgo, be happy!
I don't know, do you really need to see him to resolve things. I would think after a year you'd be ok and not have those same feelings. I know they may have come rushing back but he's still in a situation and it seems worse now. Do you really want to immerse yourself in that drama again? OMG if a year goes by for me and Virgo suddenly comes back I certainly won't let him back in! I've been there done that before and normally my feelings change drastically. Especially if I've been involved with someone else and have feelings. I never go back once it's truly over--it's never the same. And given all I've been through with Virgo that would come washing back as well and there's no way in hell I would ever go back to that place. If Virgo would just not contact me in any way I'd be good. Thing is, I think he knows that so he stays in there just so much as to ensure my feelings for him would never go away. I hope everything will turn out ok. I just don't want to see you end in heartbreak. Also I think you are looking too deeply into the statement he made about no one being there. He was just thinking only about his children; of course he didn't realize that by saying that you were included in that. You are right they compartmentalize and don't look at the big picture. He won't realize the impact it had on you unless you bring it up. Even then he won't really get it, LOL!
I met a guy at work but I'm running the other way. No more office romances for me! OMG and we have so many things in common! sigh oh me oh my! Also on the dating site I've met this Libra man. Now I've dated a few Libras and love them--when they're not trying to control me. I rebel against that and they hate it! So I'm going to talk to him to see what's up. I always seem to meet someone but not "that one". Where is he? Please don't say it's Virgo! LOL!
Have a great night all--bed time for me!
Oh, come on G4E, don't reject the possibility of getting to know the guy at work ! If you have many things in common and you like him, give him a chance ! At least try to get to know him better before throwing away this possibility. By the way, my sister and her husband had an "office romance" before they got married.
LOL! As far as the guy at work there's no interest there for me; we'll just be friends. I don't want to do the office thing again--been there tried that!
Virgo called last night and said he loved me--sort of, lol! I asked him if it was true why was he not telling me? I asked him if he truly loved/was in love with me and he said yes. I still want him to say the words if he is. That's why I am hesitant to believe him. He's so quick to say it in email/text... We're supposed to get together to talk about it.
G4E, good luck with talking to the Virgo ! You are, however, right to expect hearing it without reservations. My only concern is that once it becomes a done deal, Virgo will start doubting himself and needing emotional space ,as they do. Still, I guess it's worth the shot, at least so that you would know that you've given him a chance...